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#1 04-28-2009 11:54:47

cyberws
Member
From: Atlanta, GA
Registered: 02-05-2004
Posts: 756

Future Of MySQL (The main database for CCP)

With the announcement of Oracle buying Sun Microsystems, which owns MySQL, the future of MySQL as we know it isn't very bright.  MySQL is the world's most heavily used "open source" database.  Unfortunately Oracle is known to have an extreme distaste for open source software and even more so for MySQL.  MySQL "steals" (as Oracle sees it) millions and millions of dollars from the Oracle machine.

While Oracle has a great database it is priced at around $40,000 (USD) per cpu per server for enterprise users.  If you compare this to MySQL an enterprise can buy a whole site license for $40,000 giving them the ability to run MySQL Enterprise on unlimited amount of machines.  Now Oracle does have cheaper licenses but still they aren't anything like MySQL's prices where one can get MySQL Enterprise for $600 a year.  Then of course there is the community (free) version of MySQL.  Thus Oracle has expressed many times its dislike for MySQL.

The only saving grace for MySQL users is companies like Facebook, MySpace, Wikipedia, Google, Nokia, etc use MySQL.  In fact Facebook runs over 1800 (almost two thousand) MySQL servers and uses no other database.  These companies I guarantee won't be trapped into Oracle's heavy handed ways.  The original programmer of MySQL has already said he is researching starting a spin off version of MySQL (obviously it won't be called MySQL since Oracle will own that brand name).  There is also a project called Drizzle that is based on MySQL code.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Drizzle_(database_server)

So the bottom line is the future for MySQL users is unstable at best.  We will have to see where Oracle takes this but if history is any guide the future won't be pleasant.  I will say as a final note the most popular MySQL engine (what Facebook, Google, etc run) is InnoDB (not MyISAM) and InnoDB is owned by Oracle which has always been odd given their dislike for the database server.


Jeremy O

Production CCP .:. Version 6 w/QuickBuy and many in house hacks
Skills: PHP & Perl programming, Solaris & Linux server administration, Oracle OCP training and MySQL experience

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#2 05-06-2009 20:43:31

Anthonypi
Member
Registered: 12-10-2008
Posts: 57

Re: Future Of MySQL (The main database for CCP)

Good point , thanks for that.. i didn't know that InnoDB was used on MySQL servers more than MyISAM..
I've personally been pretty bummed since I heard this news.. although in the end I'm sure it'll work out.

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#3 05-07-2009 11:19:34

cyberws
Member
From: Atlanta, GA
Registered: 02-05-2004
Posts: 756

Re: Future Of MySQL (The main database for CCP)

Well I should clarify InnoDB is used in enterprise more than MyISAM.  For example: Google, Yahoo, Facebook, Digg, Slashdot, etc use MySQL InnoDB over MyISAM.  Most PHP scripts are programmed to use MyISAM.  MyISAM is really one of the few engines that doesn't allow for database table integrity. MS SQL, Oracle, PostgreSQL, Sybase, DB2, etc all use engines that automatically have ACID compliance.  MySQL MyISAM is one of the few that doesn't and thus enterprises don't use it much.

There has been an interesting development, that I found, since I posted this which is IBM has teamed up with EnterpriseDB to directly attack Oracle.  EnterpriseDB allows Oracle and MS SQL users the ability to run PostgreSQL without making any changes to applications.  This may force Oracle management into keeping MySQL.  I personally doubt anything will change much for a year or so but my concern is what about 4, 5, 6 years.

Oracle could help MySQL by integrating some cool technologies from the Oracle database server.  Oracle may decide it just wants to keep its name out there and sell services like IBM's Global Services.   We will just have to see as after all they will getting money from MySQL enterprise now.  I am still not holding my breath and again based on Oracle's history odds are against it.  Still who knows things do change and perhaps Oracle is going to modify its position.  They will soon control Java which is uber important to IBM.

Therefore an interesting battle of the titans is brewing with IBM and Oracle slugging it out.  IBM doesn't like Oracle.  After all Oracle stole with the US Government's help DB2's code.  That is how Oracle started as Oracle was the code name for government project.  Oracle put in a low bid for a database project to the US Government and said in order to complete it they need IBM's DB2 code.

The wounds at IBM have never fully healed and now Oracle will control Java which is a key component to IBM's Websphere line and one of IBM's most important properties.  So we will see if Oracle is going to change its tune and keep some of the open source projects like MySQL, Java, OpenOffice.org, etc or if they are going to try to close down the source and make people buy licenses or whatever.

I agree with you Anthonypi I was NOT pleased to hear the news.  Plus we run Sun Microsystems servers, along with Dell, and I fear SPARC is in big trouble with Oracle.  There is talk HP may want to buy SPARC with I would rather they own then Oracle.  This is a little off topic from MySQL but Oracle has just thrown a big wrench in the workings of the IT world.

The bottom line is things are shaky for MySQL at least in its current form.

Last edited by cyberws (05-07-2009 11:23:34)


Jeremy O

Production CCP .:. Version 6 w/QuickBuy and many in house hacks
Skills: PHP & Perl programming, Solaris & Linux server administration, Oracle OCP training and MySQL experience

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#4 05-11-2009 23:41:03

Brett2000
Member
Registered: 05-11-2009
Posts: 4

Re: Future Of MySQL (The main database for CCP)

cyberws wrote:

The bottom line is things are shaky for MySQL at least in its current form.

Holy crap, I had not heard that! I use MySQL throughout all of my websites, if Oracle tries to force licensing on hosts, and end-users, we're all in for 'big trouble'!

Keep us posted on other news Jeremy,

Thanks,
-Brett

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#5 05-12-2009 11:48:32

cyberws
Member
From: Atlanta, GA
Registered: 02-05-2004
Posts: 756

Re: Future Of MySQL (The main database for CCP)

Well worse case is something will rise from the possible ashes of MySQL.  I don't want to sound like an alarmist but MySQL's, heck all of Sun Microsystems' projects, are now in limbo.  Oracle is a company that knows how to squeeze money from everything.  Perhaps they will figure out how to get more money from MySQL Enterprise and keep community.  My guess if they keep community they will start either removing features or not adding many new ones.

I, obviously, don't have a crystal ball (wish I did) but it won't shock me to see Oracle run up the price for MySQL Enterprise and strip down MySQL community.  Still I guarantee you Google (not to mention all the others) aren't going to play with Oracle if they start up with their usual games.  The one thing I will give Oracle is quality.  MySQL's quality has suffered big time over the last few releases.  There are many articles on the net about it.  MySQL has also lost many core developers and replaced them with people that don't know the database and thus write all kinds of bugs into the program since they don't have a good concept for the whole beast.

Oracle could bring some quality to MySQL.  I realize no company can have 100% bug free code that is just life especially when you start talking huge projects like databases and operating systems.  However MySQL has terrible quality.  In reality MS SQL has far better quality.  If one is interested I have posted a link below to a very good article (not the only one) of MySQL's poor quality control.  They know of dozens of instant crash bugs that have existed for awhile, some through many versions, and have done nothing about it.  The team even acknowledges some serious bugs and still ignores them.  Even worse they have been provided with fixes from companies like Google and refused to put them into the code.

In all honesty PostgreSQL is probably the best database on the planet.  It has true open source, great quality control, is uber fast.  Still we run MySQL over PostgreSQL mainly because its hard to find PHP applications that support any database but MySQL.  So perhaps Oracle will help with quality.  We will see and I will keep my fingers crossed.

http://monty-says.blogspot.com/2008/11/ … eased.html

Last edited by cyberws (05-12-2009 11:49:41)


Jeremy O

Production CCP .:. Version 6 w/QuickBuy and many in house hacks
Skills: PHP & Perl programming, Solaris & Linux server administration, Oracle OCP training and MySQL experience

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#6 05-15-2009 17:46:40

cyberws
Member
From: Atlanta, GA
Registered: 02-05-2004
Posts: 756

Re: Future Of MySQL (The main database for CCP)

I am following up with an interesting article on MySQL and Oracle and MySQL period.  The article is pretty good and the second page is loaded with some valuable information and thoughts on the subject.  I will caution you though that toward the end of the first page there is some very vulgar language.  So if you don't like to read some strong language don't click on the link.

http://www.theregister.co.uk/2009/04/27/dziuba_sunacle/
.:.  WARNING!!! Good information but contains VULGAR language, at times.  Don't read if you don't like such things.

I also stated above, and it was mentioned in the blog above, how poor MySQL is at controlling serious bugs.  The site below was setup as a third party build to MySQL to fix serious bugs that MySQL seems indifferent too.  I should caution you as the more you learn about MySQL the less you may come to like it.  MySQL is far from a good database.  I will express it again PostgreSQL is superior to MySQL in every way except MySQL's unique ability to support different engines like MyISAM, InnoDB, Federated, etc.

http://ourdelta.org/

Last edited by cyberws (05-15-2009 17:47:03)


Jeremy O

Production CCP .:. Version 6 w/QuickBuy and many in house hacks
Skills: PHP & Perl programming, Solaris & Linux server administration, Oracle OCP training and MySQL experience

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#7 06-24-2009 23:48:16

Anthonypi
Member
Registered: 12-10-2008
Posts: 57

Re: Future Of MySQL (The main database for CCP)

"If anything, this uncertainty is a test of the open source community. Years ago, it taught Larry Ellison hate. Now, Ellison is teaching it fear."
classic... not a bad Article..thanks for the link..

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#8 09-21-2010 19:50:52

ambassador
Member
Registered: 10-27-2003
Posts: 59

Re: Future Of MySQL (The main database for CCP)

What is the status of this database matter now?

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